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We were a country that didn't have deep roots in agriculture growing food for Taste we always gruet for quantity and ship ability but never flavor and we we never had a strong sense of the table as a place of conversation and pleasure it was much more of that sort of puritanical just we're here to eat and and chill up and so when the fast food industry came in it just pulled us up by the rats sure just pulled us out and we went with it was easier to do this it was fast cheap and easy andmy parents who had a had a garden in the backyard one point stopped canning applesauce and so you I guess by the time you hit your teens you the family moved a bit right you've moved to the Midwest and then to California was this for your dad's job yes if us he was transferred to Chicago and then he was further transferred to Los Angeles so you went to so you decided when you graduate high school you went to the University of California in Santa Barbara and this isn't the early sixties and what was your impression of the placethat was pretty place then right by the water on the beach and I decided to transfer to UC Berkeley in the fall of 1964 show the fall 1964 you end up at UC Berkeley a junior college sophomore college and that really you're getting there at the time when this is like right as that the the Berkeley Free Speech movement is starting out the timer were you totally like naive and you know it was it not part of your worldand I was really shocked by what was going on but attracted to it and my friends were so deep in the same place but we all were drawn it on the list be outside of the demonstrations listening and curious and inspired ultimate do you remember seeing any of those leaders speak in his words just touch me in a very deep and he talked about how we can change the world how we had to work together and when things are so wrong we have to stopstop the gears put yourself on the line demonstrate I mean be willing to take a risk that was said willing to take a risk when you had grown up in this very sore the cloistered secluded can a 50s world and now you were in the middle of 1960s Berkeley I mean the service center of college radicalism certainly in the United States there was the war there was a free speech movement the sexual Revolution drugs I mean all these things right it must have been an exciting time I mean it really was and I think I must have had some of my mother's chains and because she pack I mean at the end of her life she said to me2 in in 1965 you are student and you have I guess an opportunity to study abroad and you went to France what what struck you about France when you got that what did you discover that you didn't quite realize until you got there on all fronts to Fry's in Paris that beautiful beautiful city I don't know if was every part of that experience it just wasn't Awakening for me it was really and when do you remember thinking there's something different about food and the connection to food here that I have never experienced before was it almost instantly after you arrived to get a Hot Pocket I wanted to eat it every morning I wanted a bowl of Cafe Au Lait I wanted to see what was inside of these little rest that we're all over Paris at that time they were very small and had pink tablecloths and and Candlelight and you pick bowls of food sitting out on the tables that you walked infeast and I just really fell for it did you start to did you start to explore the the food markets and I went through one of those markets the really old Market Street on my way to school was it just like shockingly different to what you had seen the us because it was kind of the US was the supermarket and this was really a lot beautiful beautiful vegetables that just said Look At Me by me and I was just Marcus and all the food was really from that area in and around Paris would you would you watch the markets in Paris and see produceyou have never seen before I had never had a wild strawberry and I talked about that as being the moment when I said you know what was different to eat this they were tiny so intensely flavored were served a big plate of a little picture of cream on the side and a bowl of sugar if you neededand I couldn't have enough of them and I wondered where they came from and they told me you have to go out in the woods and picks up I didn't know that I was being imprinted in that way in terms of seasonality and those life insurance because you you went around with your friend Trends in favour so picky about what restaurant to eat it and you are used to that allow us to go into the place until they had examined the various venues to see who had the food that was the tastiest and they have those clamps where did they come from but it wasn't just about foodit was the discourse at the table we would sit there maybe two hours talking politics talkin talkin about life and I was fascinated with that conversation of the table so that year obviously was going to be a turning point in your life what you didn't yet properly no didn't did that year change what you thought you wanted to do with your life did you think you know I want to I want to be a chef I want to be a cook I want to study cooking or or did you go back to Berkeley and just think all right I did my urine France and I'm backif it's more I did my hair in France and now I'm back but all the time I was cooking I wanted to eat like the French and live life so that pushed me to explore the markets and try and find the taste and I couldn't findyou know I wanted to eat in French restaurants in the city I saved all my money so I could eat in the fancy French restaurants but it didn't taste like that so you should have finished up at 8.

You see Berkeley you're cooking those French food at home and I wish I was your plan to that point to look what were you going to do with your life into his teaching Montessori Schoolis really thinking about the world in the same way I am the idea of opening your senses because those are the pathways into our minds that you're touching your tasting or smelling your listening you're seeing and that's what happened to me and friends I had Awakening of my senses and I thought well maybe I could teach and a Montessori school and there happened to be one right down the street in Berkeley so you say you got a job there as a as a preschool teacher or us and and you you know when did you must have enjoyed it at Main was that did you think of this is maybe what what I'll do it flies like that all the time I was very challenged by the three to six year old children I've never been around them before I was intimidated by that I thought it was you know complicated and that I would be exposed for my ignorance in the way that Julia Child felt at the beginning of her cooking classes here but I wasn't as determined as she was to go home and chop a pile of Funyuns properly so that I could excel at the class I wanted to experiment at home and just do what I thought I could do well so it's a late sixties you're teaching at a preschool and enjoying cooking at all how did you start to come to this idea that maybe you wanted to open a restaurantwell I was cooking for a lot of my fence at our house I was living with a printer and he was very political and he didn't fight all of his friends over for dinner and a group was producing a magazine called the San Francisco Express-Times and so they would gather at the table and I started cooking for them all and facts so much so that they said that they liked and I started doing a little cooking column called Alice's Restaurant and waited 30 of those but I was kind of going broke buying the ingredients I think maybe I could open a littlethat my friends would beg to come and eat there and I had the encouragement of this other extraordinary friend and I left with Tom Luddy who was running the telegraph Repertory Cinema and he had if parties for all of his filmmaker friends anyone's up without John Licata and Francis Coppola cooking for them they were dinner parties and they were so crazy so I'm trying to recreate this moment and then oven times in the on the show we get to this moment you know there's a business plan and there's a you know very methodical kind of processor is it it wasn't just like yeah let's just do this with let's just do this I saw that I had that inclination he said let's just go I need to know that little French restaurants in restaurants in San Francisco so we could get an idea of what it is that you're looking for and we had gone to a very special restaurant in Bolinas that was in a house I was very struck by that maybe it could be a restaurant in the house because then I could feel like I was cooking at home and then I saw this place in North Berkeley this is where Chez Panisse is today on Shattuck Avenue in Berkeley what what what was that play was just a house for rent it was a it was a plumbing shop that was in the house and all the pipes in / out in front and sort of the courtyard in front and it was so very plain stucco house two floors and I love the location and it was commerciallyavailable yet this is where I'm sort of one like you are broke because you were spending all your money do these dinner parties so just just a business question for him I mean did you how did you even have the money to sign a lease or to make a commitment or to refurbish the place that you have to go and ask friends to absolutely and my parents mortgage their house they had police believed in me they believed in all their kids I guess we should acknowledge that you also did borrow money from other sources like there's a Berkeleyokay so see you get get this lease and remember how much money you had to raise from family and drug dealers over like to ask whatever you did actually have the confidence to like sinus this lease agreement but people who gave me some money is still on the board of directors say pennies and he was a friend of Tom ludie's if he found the people that had the confidence that I didn't have any sense I think you need to get connected with Paul perito because he has cooking skills and he's got all these copper pots and he knows how to make a risotto and I'm sure he could be a partner for you were these people who were investing in you and the restaurantthey think they were investing and that they were going to get a return on their investment or was it just like it is a cool idea Alice like this is Ruby let's let's have a place where we can be really

To become and remain a registered ROCK EMPIRE member, you must have Internet access and a valid email account.Apart from other things, it will make a change to the time it takes for us to get the food out for customers and that, of course, is important.”The new kitchen is worth observing in itself as the mini-army of chefs and waiters go about the super-demanding task of preparing dishes for customers which can, amazingly, number upwards of 2,500 on an average day.It is worth taking the time, between courses maybe, to tour the various rooms and corridors so as to get a real handle on the history of the place.No machines, scripts or automated services may be used to access any part of the ROCK EMPIRE website or in any other way participate in this program.Over usage of ROCK EMPIRE system resources is not permitted, and is grounds for account suspension or termination at the sole discretion of 106.1 CHEZ.

.70 and I would have been ashamed if I had been looking to make money nobody it was involved with this project expect to make money we hope to but we didn't expect it it was some type of love and we were doing it in thisvery non-professional way if he will I thought I had a little bit of experience because I had waited on tables and a couple of money in high school so when you when you really kind of start to ramp up to open up the restaurant I mean you never run a restaurant and Running a Restaurant is a is a really challenging than this most restaurants eventually fail where you at anyway intimidated or nervous about all of those people who are putting their faith in this thing working or where or not I knew that if the food was really good that people would comereally deeply read about it and so we thought we could do one menu a day so this was not ambitious we didn't think so when were you able to actually open the restaurant August 28th 1971 and this was a French traditional sort of traditional French restaurant Westbury French restaurant look like what did you have a an idea of what how you wanted it to be absent from when she was an artistshe had lots of ideas about how we could find things at the flea market and Alameda so I would go with her at find silverware mismatched silver where's the giant flea market in Alameda that they still have open it flowers on the table and wanted to Kendall and Martine to sign the very first poster that we had for the restaurant we put in a frame put out in front of that night and I greeted people at the doorand a what what what what what did you serve in that my first meal that first night we served a pate en croute cornichons on the side and then we had duck with olives and I think that was Victoria she felt really confident and putting those trays of ducks in the oven if it's duck-fat everywhere I remember and the tallest and with some sort of potato celery root puree and then see how much was that that set meal I think of is 395 America's best restaurants actually inspired a revolution in the restaurant industryhey everyone just a quick things to two of our sponsors who helped make this podcast possible first to E-Trade investing your money shouldn't require Moving Mountains no matter how much or how little experience you have betrayed makes investing simple along with great value they provide the tools and support you need to navigate to Market all the help your money work hard for you for more information visit NPR E-Trade Securities LLC member s i p c thanks also to Zip Recruiter hiring used to be hard multiple job sites tax resumes today hiring can be easy and you only have to go to one place to get it done Zip Recruiter Zip Recruiter since your jobs over 100 of the web's leading job boards been Zip Recruiter scams thousands of resumes to find people with the right experience and invite them to apply to your job try it for free at ziprecruiter.comhey Sophie reisberg host of NPR's ask me another and this month we're celebrating women in comedy and this week from the Netflix series Russian.

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We're joined by co-creator leslye Headland and actor Greta Lee we challenge them to not one but two games about real nesting dolls and fashionable food Trends listen And subscribe nowhey welcome back to how I built this from NPR it's 1971 and Alice Waters has just opened up Chez Panisse and she's trying to capture some of the magic she felt eating at restaurants in Paris and pretty soon the tables are starting to fill up and Alice there she has to figure out how to run a company and I was out in the dining room trying to make it work and I know that everybody who works there was passionate about the same idea I decided that we couldn't run the restaurant without these people who were critical to taste it to the place looked ways at the cafe run was running and so we we formed a corporation and we had people I bought stock in this and that helped us to run the restaurant but I also gave shares to the people that were instrumental and we had this group of people that believed in the project and infested inner were U of A and it sounds like you were getting your own business education as this was happening right because you you hadn't got a business school and you as you say you didn't you didn't go into this thinking you wanted to make money in fact that was anathema to you in some ways but you still had to run a business cuz they were people whose livelihoods were depending on this and part is that what was happening where you kind of learning as you want to learn about shares in about a corporation about have a structure these things absolutely learning by doing the Chesapeake Montessoriidea that actually doing that works at your learning about its value and what is critical and what it really means to clean up the restaurant after hours and what those people needed to be paid but a dishwasher should be paid I remember I got a very powerful lesson about garbage from one of the guy who who brought the fish to the restaurant really early on the sky political friend to find from way back who collected muscles along the coast and he would bring them into the restaurant and he said to me one day I want you to come out and see the dumpsterand I want to help me pull it open then didn't smell very good and he said I want you to get in the dumpster I want you to know what it feels like to be not careful about the way you put garbage in this container and it was a big wake-up call for me you were the center of this hub-and-spoke and still are but at that time I mean it it's it's strikes me that and I hope I'm not the sort of extrapolating but you wanted to do this because you loved to do it and you wanted to be around people you like that he wanted people to be happy but a business and inevitable you're going to run into sin 2 challenges with forthwith person out with people who just are not working out did you see those early days you know what if you want to fire people was it the hoseshard for you what if you had to discipline people did you just avoid that I tried to avoid that I did but I avoided it and a very different way I tried to hire friends that really help me to solve the problems when you're working in the business and you're working Indo 15 hours a day or whatever you're doing to be with people I liked and that I shared the value Swift and so I was willing to take the risk of it not working out and fortunately there are very few times where that became an issue what what was it that was driving you at that time that was really motivating me because you weren't making money and you weren't going to make any money for a long time and it seemsmoney wasn't really the source of tension right I mean is that is that was that the secret at least at the beginning because everyone says don't hire your friends don't work with your friend but if I get some money is not really this thing that everyone is chasing that is no there's no, because money is really the center of conflicts in business yes and I wanted a place and always have wanted to place that I wanted to be in and that it was constantly growing and changing and that's happened when different people brought ideas into the restaurant and I think what reallyhas created the song life for the restaurant is the fact that we don't have one person who is the main chef of the restaurant we have two people and they share their job they work 3 days and then they're paid for 5 and it allows time to recover and have ideas and don't worry about you though I mean in this business was your baby at that point I'm going to have to mention that you were working like crazy working all of a 7 days a week and I just about seven days a week they were closed on Sundays and I just threw myself into it was the thing that just kept kept was it that mean some people describe the fear of failure some people describe you know the the bottom line some people describe this sort of in Tangerpassion like what what was it that kept you showing up for 15 hours a day 7 days a week and it's different every day you have to find those ingredients you have to put them together differently people have to want to come there and taste that maybe I was pushed more quickly into finding ingredients and I really believe that that sort of Sir let me to the doorsteps of the local organic farmers & Ranchers but it was that they gavekey to the restaurant and a couple days or weeks later says this is one of the four best restaurants in the United States what what happened after that came out cuz you were like this Collective communal all of a sudden this guy says one of four best restaurants in the United Statesalmost overwhelmingly so that we weren't prepared for that clientele this is this is probably ultra-wealthy people flying to the Bay Area for the weekend and eat at your restaurant right I think probably some of them and that way But ultimately it led to my conclusion that my friends couldn't afford to eat there and couldn't get in but it made me think about it really seriously and I've think again at times I teased her urging that I get back to my wrists that I really loved simple food and it was a trip to Italy actually when I saw a pizza oven in about 1978 that I said we need to create a real Cafe Bistro upstairs that is more affordable that is more affordable where we don't worry about money so much because pasta isn't too expensive to me and maybe pizzas aren't in that would be a place for friends togetheras as restaurant to get more attention especially after James Beard and more media attention you started to become a celebrity you started to become a famous person Acheson Berkeley but nationally-known was that strange for you or I mean did you even notice or bad in the simulate that idea or were you just kind of doing your thing I mean you can't help but be impressed friend Newsweek magazine wants to put you out there and I never expected that kind of attention to what I thought was a pretty simple local community restaurant in Berkeley California I mean what was clear to me thenand is very very clear to me now is that we were doing something sort of against the fast-food culture of this country that we were creating a meal that was supporting a slow food movement that was actually buying its food directly from the people who took care of the land no middle man giving them all the money and then they brought their values into the restaurant and that it changed us and we became really political we started writing their names on the cafe clips that this came from Bob canards fordid people come to you and say Alice you know we got a way to make Chez Panisse cafes and Chez Panisse expresses and you know you got to Branch out and open open them all over the country in the world in and we can get investors and Venture money and we can do a whole Alice Waters line at Target in and Kmart and I mean that must have happened rightthey're the ones that breathes life into it and should make some money from it I just couldn't imagine knowing have franchises work if that there would ever be a way to do it to do in a way that that align with your own values I had to use that term to but feels like I'm doing it just to make the money I just cannot think about it that way but it's more than that I can't ever imagine flying around the world to visit my restaurant that's what I like about being a restaurant trees is that I know the people who works there and it's the pleasure of my everyday life I I'm friends with them I know the customers who come in I love that aspect of it this was maybe we could if we stopped that the story here it would be impressive and Chez Panisse was this really cool restaurant but that's really not I mean that's what it's for the beginning of the story because what's interesting about about Chez Panisse is that there's a virtual consensus among shafts in the United States that what we consideryou know which every restaurant does now or talking describing the source of of produce like they all agree that started at Chez Panisse in the late seventies that that this was the restaurant that really created the farm to table movement how did that happen if you were a French restaurant and you were serving great food but was there was it just a kind of a Natural Evolution or did you observe point where you thought look one California this is like the breadbasket of North America you know we can actually Source all the stuff locally and and tell people are come fromif it happened so naturally I'm not not really consciously trying to do that it became California without us really identifying that right away or California Med local yes Foods in cooked in a to sort of a you know I'm fast way right for me for sure a very simple kind of cooking and we are really at the beginning it in this country discovering the ingredients that we have to cook with and I have always been focused on the organic aspect of it really insistent on how the animals are cared forand what they are set completely I wanted to be about purity of food we need to be thinking about all of these different aspects for the survival of the planet and and for our nourishment when you start to focus on school food farm-to-table which I guess you didn't really call a farm-to-table did you think that you were building a movement did you think that this was going to become something really big or did you just do it because you thought that was the right thing to dobut at the beginning I thought it was the right thing to do but I felt there and the late seventies the early eighties especially when the cafe became so successful that we had this audience and that we need to talk about taking care of the land for the future and it really came into my Consciousness when my daughter was bornand I felt like Chez Panisse could not be an island unto itself that we were affected by everything that was upstream and around the world and I became very conscious of that and it's started to actively talk about it and every way I could every article that was written about the restaurant from that point O on was really talking about how dependent and how easy it is to have a relationship with the farmer and how exciting it was to talk to that person on the phone or to see farm and talk about the planting and all of thatthe grow your own back to the land movement is something that I hope happens again and soon because that is what is going to bring us a real economy when we can find a way to bring culture to agriculture when we can bring security to the farmers who take care of the land when we can buy directly from them they will want to take care of Nature and I know many are doing that young people around the country and I'm thrilled bywhen you think about organic today it's everywhere so it's actually a huge value-add for businesses to use that term organic when they can cuz they can charge more money it's everywhere you can go to Costco and Walmart and Target and buy organic gummy bears and organic salads and organic candy and organic apple juice and whatever everything's organic right are you a part of that is connected to farm to table because it's been active option for people or or you know you go to any any fast food place in the will say farm fresh eggs well everyday becomes ultimately from a farm a question is what is that farm when you see like you know what when you see that everything is organic today and everything is described as farm to table or is Parkview happy about that I'm proud of that I'm troubled by it I'm very troubled about the labelingon packages and what how people are taking the values of our movement and greenwashing their Industrial Products and we have to learn and be educated about what those words really mean is it certified organic and who is certifying it where's it coming from or the practice is at these Farms he meant are they taking care of their Farm Workers are they paying them a decent wage what about the packagingis it called plastic what does fresh mean for some places it could be two weeks old who do you trust us when you are a public figure and you are associated with a really important movement inevitably you will be criticized there will be somebody who could have sent it to you and you receive your fair share of it's a nice little say that you know this is what she's talking about only applies to affluent people if people can afford to restaurants and people of the money for organic foods do you do you internalize that criticism do you think about it does it change how you think about what you do do you ignore itseeing 10 colors of carrots it's kind of thrilling I cook a purple and orange carrots last night and that's that's what is going to make the revolution if you will I call it a delicious Revolution but it's it's about winning people over it's not by overthrowing it's not by separating we need the biodiversity of people just like we need the biodiversity and nature to surviveyou you won the James Beard awards he was in 1992 your name the best chef In America which is interesting because you are in some ways you're not best known as a chef I mean obviously you're known as a chef but your best known asthe person behind me move that do you do you feel more proud of one than the other do you see yourself as a chef primarily or do you see yourself as on the l i c a really good cook and I see myself as a great critic and taster and I'm not a chef chef stop saying that because you are a chef your friend a kitchen and a few from the kitchen you're a chef but for me Chef goes into that you know a training like like Julia Child did you know when she cook every single thing under book and she brought such wonderful instructions that that's not ever beensomething that I've aspired to do when you when you think about the success of Chez Panisse you know whether an egg and it's interesting how we define success cuz it's not it's not a silly financial success of course people have done well and have been dead live comfortable lives but it's not you know a billion-dollar Corporation we think about the success of Chez Panisse and then the the kind of the movements that came out of it and which we didn't really talk about it but all of the shafts you kind of came out of that world to and created their own Worlds how much of your own personal success do you attribute to just lock and Circumstance and how much do a tribute to your skill and hard work and your determination I didn't know how that would reveal itself I didn't reflect on it at the time but I just absorbed what I call a human values at that time you know the big picture of eating together how people have done since the beginning of time always taking care of the laugh because that's where the food came from they've always thought of food is precious so to you the biggest factors Alice Waters founder and owner of Chez Panisse an organization called the edible schoolyard project which sets up organic Gardens in schools and teach his children daycare for cook and enjoy fresh produce today the original edible schoolyard in Berkeley also offers training programs for parents and teachers to replicate the project throughout the u.s.please do stick around because in just a moment we're going to hear from you about the things your building but first a quick thanks to our 2019 how I built this lead sponsor hiscox hiscox tailoring its insurance policies to fit every business has very specific needs which may explain its 97% customer service rating get a quote or buy it hiscox in courage couragehey thanks so much for sticking around because it's time now for how you built that and today story starts in Dallas in 2003 when Pierceton Gaines was a teenager and wanted to make a change my play soccer throughout my life I always just wore my hair in braids and then when I was going into high school I decided that I wanted to wear my hair straight take my braids out and wear my hair straight like many African American women Pierceton has highly textured hair but her hair is also very fine if I straightened it would curl up as soon as I sweat as soon as I took a shower if your son has never had it chemically straightened before so she went to a stylist and.

The treatment and it first her hair looks great but then I was in geometry class and there is a guy behind me who said Pearson all of your hair is on my desk yeah it was bad it was really bad pierced in lost her hair all of it and it took a long time to grow back now this happened again2 years later which is why Pearson was wary of new salons but in 2016 when she moved to Boston to go to Harvard Business School she really needed someone to do her hair one of my friends said that she was going to a girl at Drybar it is an Express Salon Service they only do blowouts you know I've never seen anyone who would my type of hair walk out of there and I was scared but I was like I don't really have an option right now but it turns out the stylist knew exactly what she was doing the experience was just amazing I would honestly like an hour and a half which has never happened to me in all the times I've been going to the salon since I was a kid and her hair looks amazing so she was hooked Pierceton booked a weekly standing appointment but it did last she left that she like she moved out of state so.

Orgthanks so much for listening to the show this week you can subscribe wherever you get your podcast while you're there please do give us a review you can also write to us at HIV tea at NPR.

To become and remain a registered ROCK EMPIRE member, you must have Internet access and a valid email account.Apart from other things, it will make a change to the time it takes for us to get the food out for customers and that, of course, is important.”The new kitchen is worth observing in itself as the mini-army of chefs and waiters go about the super-demanding task of preparing dishes for customers which can, amazingly, number upwards of 2,500 on an average day.It is worth taking the time, between courses maybe, to tour the various rooms and corridors so as to get a real handle on the history of the place.No machines, scripts or automated services may be used to access any part of the ROCK EMPIRE website or in any other way participate in this program.Over usage of ROCK EMPIRE system resources is not permitted, and is grounds for account suspension or termination at the sole discretion of 106.1 CHEZ.

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